
…ok…i wasn’t sure if i wanted to post this at first because i have a grave fear of pointing people in the wrong direction when it comes to their own personal pursuit of God, but 2 things made me reconsider: (1) i know for a fact that anyone who seeks God on their own will find Him(Her), regardless of the bumblings of man… and (2) my manager “Jody”said he thinks I should write more on the subject of God and the church…so here goes. but i must say, as if you dont already know, all that follows is purely my opinion which is subject to change as -am I under the consultation of God…i like anybody else am a work in progress- so consideration of what i wrote is fine, but direct yourself to God for the ultimate truth.. (i know, i know, not even that serious right?…well, i felt like i had to say that)
~
[small intro- my friend's girlfriend posts a convo she has with a pastor on facebook, and tags me in it. what follows is her post and then my thoughts in reply]
her post:
Pastor Claude had added me to his facebook friends list. I assumed that I had met him in church because he was my pastor’s friend on facebook. So i added him. 2nite i saw that he was online and asked him when we met. He said we were relatives. I was very confused by this. Then he said we were all children of God. So I took it that he just goes around adding random people on fb. Anyway, he asked if i was an adventist. I said I used to be. He asked me why and I told him that I could not find any proof that the Bible is really God’s word. I pointed out that Horus, Krishna, and Mithra to name a few all have pretty much the same exact story as Jesus and they lived way before he was born. Horus 2,000 years b4 Jesus. He told me I would believe anything. I told him that it’s true and he can read it in any historical book. After calling me some more names i asked him…
Davonne
y do you beleive the bible is true when there is no evidence?
there are many religions
how do i know its the god of the bible
not the god of he hindus
or the shintos
or the muslims
which one is right?
how do u know?
There is a god! i agree
i beleive
11:47pm
Claude
i believe you are sick
11:47pm
Davonne
how?
ur just calling me names and ur not answering me
11:48pm
Claude
no body in their right mind could be speaking like that
11:49pm
Davonne
i’ve read about a talking snake, a flood that covers the entire earth, sacrifice, holy war where women and children are murdered
all in the bible
11:50pm
Claude
and
11:50pm
Davonne
how is it normal to think these things happened?
u beleive in a talking snake?
11:50pm
Claude
salvation is by faith
11:50pm
Davonne
and im the sick one
y do u have faith?
when there is no evidence?
11:50pm
Claude
belief
God that dwells in you
11:51pm
Davonne
why do u beleive, have faith without evidence
11:51pm
Claude
and inner experience with God
11:51pm
Davonne
my inner experience with god tells me killing the innocent is wrong
especially children
11:51pm
Claude
and you are killing yourself
11:52pm
Davonne
how by not beleiving in a talking snake?
why do u think you are the one that is right?
u still have not answered
11:52pm
Claude
not me GOd and the bible
11:53pm
Davonne
why do you think the bible is real when there is no evidence that most of the events happened?
11:54pm
Claude
thats your belief
11:54pm
Davonne
Proof is not something for which someone can agree or disagree, but rather reflect upon.
do u have proof that the bible is real?
11:55pm
Claude
yes i do
11:55pm
Davonne
good
where so i can read it
and feel better
11:56pm
Claude
Psalm 1
all of it
11:57pm
Davonne
how is a page in the bible proof? that the bible isnt a story
Blessed is the man who does not walk in the counsel of the wicked or stand in the way of sinners or sit in the seat of mockers.
wat makes this proof
11:58pm
Claude
read it till u understand
11:59pm
Davonne
i understand… it says dont be a sinner or else u’ll pay
in the end
how is that proof that a sinner will pay?
Davonne
do you have any proof outside the bible that was written at the time of jesus
ive been looking for it
Josephus lived hundreds of years after the death of Christ
im guessing u dont have any proof
i’d rather u be honest with me… being that ur a pastor and all
12:03am
Claude
the devil is speaking to yu so when you see the truth you wont know it
he will make you believe a lie
12:04am
Davonne
that’s your answer to me? the devil is stopping me from finding proof outside the bible written when jesus was alive
he must be keeping this evidence from everyone. including christians like you
12:05am
Claude
u need prayer
go to your bed and ask god to reveal the truth to you..
12:06am
Davonne
been there, done that
prayer doesnt give me that evidence
just please answer the question… do you have proof outside the bible
yes or no
its very simple
12:07am
Claude
being alive is enough proof
12:08am
Davonne
our dna is proof of evolution
the earth is proof of billions of years
12:09am
Claude
you are heading to the wrong place baby
anyway i have a flight in a few hours i am gonna get some rest
12:09am
Davonne
ok
12:09am
Claude
your Gods will keep you tonight
12:09am
Davonne
hope u can find that evidence someday
u are very condescending
and mean
12:10am
Claude
im a proof of Gods goodness
12:10am
Davonne
i came for information
and all u did was put me down
12:10am
Claude
you are ungrateful
12:10am
Davonne
i never called u a name
you show ur religion to be mean
thanx alot
12:11am
Claude
i cant believe a living person do such things to God
12:11am
Davonne
you’re not a good representative
u arent a pastor
a pastor keeps his sheep
12:11am
Claude
you are like Peter who denied christ
12:11am
Davonne
not chastize them
im asking for proof
that’s all
12:12am
Claude
very soon you will betray him if you havent already
12:12am
Davonne
u of all people should be able to give it
12:12am
Claude
u dont want proof
12:12am
Davonne
i do actually
12:12am
Claude
ur contoversial
12:12am
Davonne
i study probably more than you
12:12am
Claude
and dont know God
wow
12:12am
Davonne
i’ve most likely read more e.g white than u have in your life
12:13am
Claude
stop studying
12:13am
Davonne
doesnt proverbs say something about a fool says he beleives and does not study
12:14am
Claude
im going to sleep
have a good night
God need to be in your heart
==================
My Comment
(1)I find it interesting that he refers to you as “sick”…but does not acknowledge his role as a “doctor”. jesus himself said “look after the sick”
(2)The bible and God are two different things. “God” is recognized as the disputed source of all being, experienced by, but beyond the limitations, definition, and perhaps even understanding of man.
again…BEYOND man, but experienced (felt, “seen”, “heard”) by man…
…the Bible is a combination of jewish and christian writings chronicling the faith journey leading up to and following the birth of Christ.
thusly, the bible is not the inerrant word of God. it is he word of man IN SEARCH OF God.
(3)The message of the bible in regard to sin is we are all sinners saved by GRACE…meaning, we couldnt stop sinning if we tried, but we are not SUBJECT to sin OR its penalty in the blood (ie: life) of christ (at least, that is what is taught in the life and death of christ. ie: what is believed by christians- at least those who know of whom they follow)
(4) Claude was right to advise you to pray (ie: consult God, not man)…but the proof you search for will not be whispered in your ear while you are kneeling at your bed…the proof in what you ask God will mostly likely be revealed in the world around you IN PERFECT time with your ability to understand it.
example: if you were a toddler and you ask me what water was made of, and i gave you the exact chemical makeup of water…would you fully understand it then? …probably not, but in time…all would be revealed…as you sought for said truth..until you were satisfied. Such is the truth of God and his/her law(s)
(5) Evolution and God (contrary to secular schooling) do not cancel each other out. one seeks to answer HOW, the other seeks to answer WHY.
(6)You’re absolutely correct. the story of most saviors follow the same narrative. but the story isnt nearly as important as the MESSAGE. and if we can conclude the same story has been told countless times in countless corners of the earth- as an indication of closeness to unadulterated truth in God, wouldnt you think there must be some underlying communal message of truth deep within EVERY historical savior story? something MAN himself couldn’t even distort/cover up?
and
(7) I have a question for you (you dont have to answer though): in what spirit do you seek the information you ask for? …it’s very clear that you are knowledgeable enough to see error in this pastors rhetoric, but what good does it serve your quest to belittle him and mock his ignorance?
if the God he gives you is one of judgement…and you KNOW this cannot be the true nature of God…ask yourself what IS God’s nature…and present it to your “enemy” that he may be ENLIGHTENED..not persecuted. (just a suggestion)
===
i’m sorry you had to experience an unsatisfactory moment, not to mention one with the a memeber of clergy, davonne..but your search does not end here.
do not look to man for the face of God. look to God earnestly and without ceasing, and EVERY question you ask will be answered…
i dont say this because it was said to me. i say this because i’ve tried it and i live by it.
correction: i was hasty to say claude does not acknowledge his role as a doctor, but all doctors do not exercise perfect manners when considering patients.
if you do not like your healthcare provider davonne, talk to his employer. and if you dont like him, keep going higher until you can go no more.
~
-sah
**UPDATE 10.29.09** it turns out Claude is NOT a pastor at all. my friend mistook him for one.
Recent Comments